Subject: R.I.P. Nelson Mandela: 1918-2013

some things have worsened since the overthrow of the Afrikaner regime

You're right again... Maybe it's better to restore the Afrikaner regime... Never mind if it's called apartheid...

Sorry, but I'm tired to raise all your contradictions... So, definitely bye...

Most people don't see the difference between Stalin and Lenin, don't expect them to know a lot about Mandela.

The only message conveyed in media is sth similar to "Mandela ended the apartheid", end of story :).

We live in 1-0 world, media portray everything as black or white, according to their political afiliation.

You haven't written a single argument, all you do is repeated sarcasm, definitely no sense in such discussion:)

One does not have to adore Mandela to oppose apartheid.

Most people don't see the difference between Stalin and Lenin, don't expect them to know a lot about Mandela.

I just want people to be critical of what the mainstream media and/or politicians tell them.

We live in 1-0 world, media portray everything as black or white, according to their political afiliation.

Black or white, it seems the media have taken over the apartheid ideology.

And yes, history is always written by those who have won.

I just explained Mandela had right to fight against apartheid, just as resistants had right to fight against nazism during World war II... That's all.

There are resistants and there are bastards

I do not have even slightest respect for resistance members who killed and raped civilians in vendetta actions.

Being a part of restistance movement is not an excuse for inhumane actions.

to change the world if the world want is no need a superhero the world can change instantaneous

Here we are...

That's the real difference between us : I must admit I have the greatest respect for resistance members who killed innocent nazis ...!

But sorry, I am sarcastic again...;-)

Well, you're a monster if you respect those who killed children and women just because they were of the same country that those, who attacked the country of the resistants.

I don't believe in collective responsibility.

It's not exactly what I've said, but it's not a problem... I assume : I am the devil and you are the angel... Is it ok for you ? Thanks then...

(edited)

That's exactly your problem, you don't look for the details because you're happy with general info:

Nazis bad
Resistance against Nazis = good
Mandela ended apartheid = good

etc.

You're right... I always thought nazism was the worst ideology the world has ever known... In general, but in details too !

You're doing it again.

Resistance against Nazis = good
Mandela ended apartheid = good

I do believe that's the big picture. If you don't believe in collective responsibility, then the suffering of innocents shouldn't make turn things negative in general. Innocent people suffer in every war from both parties at least in some cases. These are also individual crimes. Hiroshima, Nagasaki, the bombardement of Dresden, looting, robbing, raping women, etc are all warcrimes done by the Allies (leadership, and individual soldiers). It's sad, that people who did this never had to take responsibility for their crimes on the victorious side. But I think things would be worse now, if the Axis would win, so Allies victory = good.

I do believe that's the big picture.

Come on. You can't be serious? Mandela is a saint according to almost all the media and the people take that over without any further questions asked. And if one is critical on Mandela, arguments like "you liked apartheid" are never far away.