Subject: Match Engine Change

now big midfield's teams have more chance to win.
Because when the Gkeeper try to "shoot" the ball.....it come back more quickly than before===> little midfield's teams will defend all the time against big midfield's teams===> we know this game...Hattrick. :(

Why? if your keeper has a decent passing ability he will "shoot" the goal kick to your players regardless where they are.


When we'll play in league, we're going to scored like in Rugby....longshots is good...but without GK jumping....it's just funny and not serious.

Just because GK jumping and throwing is not yet implemented in the match viewer doesn't mean that it is not in the match engine. Check your match reports.

Yes, but it was OK the way it was now, strikers needed now a little bit of playmaking too. But this thing is very "artificial": dribbling defenders depends on technique but dribbling keepers depends on playmaking and scoring?

It's not logic, it's not fair, it's not consistent...

That's putting too much weight in strikers' playmaking (at least, if they want to effectively dribble a keeper, and that's something that you can't control :().

Any skill you want but not technique, because people started to think that technique will decide on nearly everything. In fact dribbling over keepers will be rare situation (how often keeper catches ball when your attacker is dribbling in current engine or older?), and skill used is very unimportant - it's just feature for "show"...
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I really liked the changes (for the moment :p) but I hope my players won't be placed that bad in league match (it has been nearly 2 seasons I play with the same tactic)

Remember that the announcement said :"For testing all matches will be played with the lowest value of positioning for all players.", so expect extreme mis-positionings in today's friendlies.

edit: typo
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Wise..

I know since I translated the news in french :)

I am trying to understand positioning. :)

Is it like experience? Would a player with 100 games played have better positioning then a rookie?

Is it true that's it's not trainable?

Our MOD said something like that on the Hungarian forum

Think of striker-goalkeeper duels this way:

It's not that one wants to dribble another - it's the situation in which strikers seeks the proper moment to shoot.

So ... which skill should be responsible for the proper moment of shot ? Yes - playmaking.
And which one if it will be effective or not ? Yes - shooting.

There you have an answer :]]

But which skill is responsible of the dribbling? Your explanation is missing one step there:

When do I shoot (sooner or later)? Ok, Playmaking.

How to I shoot? Ok, scoring.

But: I have already decided to shoot later (namely, I need to dribble). How do I dribble? The answer should be: Technique.

It's that the way it works?

sydval about positioning:

In italian forum we suggested (proposal) to consider this skill concerned with the number of the matches played

also in real life, the tactical sense or sense of positioning is not a default ability but it would increase by playing more and more matches

nice idea, and playing an NT match would also be a benefit to the player in the sense of improving his positioning skill

This engine change is not good......bad thing :/

GK do not jump in sokker...I see...pfff...you can tell that "chek you match reports"....GK do not jump on the left or on the right...never!!

This game will become like Ht..........a poor game. I'm sad but it's my feeling about this Engine.

Great rules :D

Any skill you want but not technique, because people started to think that technique will decide on nearly everything. In fact dribbling over keepers will be rare situation (how often keeper catches ball when your attacker is dribbling in current engine or older?), and skill used is very unimportant - it's just feature for "show"...


Thanks for your response, greg.

But I don't understand the point about people complaining that technique decides on nearly everything. That's wrong:

Technique was already deciding on dribbling (which is OK and nobody can legitimately complain about this). Now, you are adding just a new dribbling event (the new thing is not the dribbling, is that now you can dribble the keeper).

So, there is nothing wrong just leaving the technique in order to determine how successful will be a dribbling against the keeper (that is not giving technique any new role, technique is just keeping its "old" role).

Of course, decisions such as whether to dribble or not, or to shoot sooner or later, should depend on different skills (most probably, playmaking), I agree with that.

_____

Now, you say that dribbling keepers will be something rare (I agree with you, I haven't seen any today yet :P). But you also say that is just " for show" . Just let me understand:

Does it mean that the "dribbling keeper situation" is just a sort of "animation" of a previously decided event (i.e, shooting) and not an event in itself?

Then, that would explain everything and I would understand why you are considering playmaking and scoring (because there is no "real" dribbling, just an "animation" ).
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Positioning should work in the following manner....

Defenders with high positioning skill will mark players even when they are away from the ball, rather than just standing in their tactical spot. They will also be more adept at cutting off through passes.

Defenders with poor skill will play like they do now, in a spot rather than playing a man. They will also be slightly away from where they should be according to your tactic.

Mids with high positioning should look to dribble into space to set up their pass, rather than heading straight towards the goal. Away from the ball they will move into space in order to be open for a pass, without leaving the general area of their spot in the tactic. On defense they will also mark players when away from the ball if someone's close to their assigned tactical spot.

Mids with poor positioning skill won't do those things and will play right where you've told them, with occasional lapses where they are caught slightly away from their assigned spot.

Strikers with high positioning skill will actually work into an open area to set up an incoming pass, rather than standing in their assigned spot.

Strikers with poor positioning would stand still, in their assigned spot, while sometimes getting 'lost' and being slightly away from their spot.

Positioning should either be an 'experience' skill in that it starts low and increases based upon the players underlying talent level, or a trianable skill that is trained like pace, with everyone who plays a match that week being trained.

To begin with, all existing players should recieve their positioning skill based on either the number of matches they've played, or an overall average of their existing skills.

My opinions at least, until someone puts forth another opinion that changes them.

Agree with most of what you've said. For my post on the england forum:

I wonder if positioning will be all to do with the location of the oppositon players relative to your own, and relative to the position you have them in in the tactic (reading that again has made me laugh at myself a bit, it's kind of a definition of positioning -but to explain how I'm guessing it might work in practice):

So in possession, your players would try to find space, if they weren't in it already.

Out of possession, they would try to mark the opposition players and close them down, if those players were within a certain distance from them.

Also wonder if it will affect offsides - eg strikers staying onside and defenders pushing up to catch the opposition offside?

Other consideration is coaches - another skill will perhaps mean new coaches needed all round and throw existing wage guidelines out. Not that that's a major big deal.

Overall, could be interesting - looking forward to my friendly now, and for a bit more info on this.

Also think that use of games played as decider of positioning skill would be a good way of doing it.

I think the bigger improvement hasn`t been talked yet.

I think the rule that the player nearest the opponent player should go after him and the other players who could reah that player better, stay in the same position, is a crap.

That would be a great improvement...
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