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Subject: Is European Union good or bad thing?
i think, slowtackle thinks like me. right? join EU is great thing for a country for its economy..... but i dont want, i just said that. and i'll never say my thought because it is personal thing. everybody can think everything about each them.
The EU is a grand concept that has some benefits just like the UN, It is clearly more effective than the UN, which is an organization that is theoritically sound, but in practice is unfeasible
The problem with EU is that the countries of EU haven't a union political line. EU is an economical giant and a political dwarf ;-)
European Union is the key to the future for/of Europe. Get used to it :-)
Hi Kliang, thanks for post here. I've always wondered what americans think about EU.
I think it'd be good for me if EU would become something very close to USA, but we aren't. I guess also in the 50 States there are a lot of difference in behaviour, culture, tradition and so on. But we can easly think about USA as a real and united Country, while actually I see EU only just like a faded copy.
Ultimately, EU exists (with different names) from 50 years, but still we aren't a Country. So I wonder what's wrong with us (if there's something wrong). Could it be the too many different languages we speack? Should we transfer more political power from our nations to EU? Are we destined to never merge in an unic great country?
I do hope my sons will live in a great, free and proud country, at least when I'll be dead.
I think it'd be good for me if EU would become something very close to USA, but we aren't. I guess also in the 50 States there are a lot of difference in behaviour, culture, tradition and so on. But we can easly think about USA as a real and united Country, while actually I see EU only just like a faded copy.
Ultimately, EU exists (with different names) from 50 years, but still we aren't a Country. So I wonder what's wrong with us (if there's something wrong). Could it be the too many different languages we speack? Should we transfer more political power from our nations to EU? Are we destined to never merge in an unic great country?
I do hope my sons will live in a great, free and proud country, at least when I'll be dead.
I thought that Italy is great, free and proud country. Maybe corruption and economical differences between south and north, but who cares when he should have tasty pizza or pasta every day.
I and majority of my friends dont want European State. I am sure that many British, French, Swedish or Hungarians too. Thats why French and Dutch citizens refused European constitution and therefore citizens lost possibility to decide what European Union should like any more with "exception"of Irish.
One of reason is, how you said, difference of cultures. European culture was that great because was very diverse. EU is trying unify everything, and therefore we are losing own culture and getting new one. You should say thats globalization which occurs everywhere, but EU plays significant role in it. USSR tried pretty same, when you look at Eastern bloc, there were trying to make everything uniform. But valued culture came mainly from environment which was opossite and dissent.
EU often claims that its trying maintain free market and internationalism. But when I observe its development, all led to continentalism and protectionism. At the same time when they started removing barriers between EU countries, they also started making barriers towards other world. The great humanistic ideas became tool how to protect own interests. Interests which were part of nationalism didn´t disappeared, they were just maintained in whole Europe for more power. What a shame.
Now we are all paying in taxes European bureaucracy(billions just for bureaucracy which in 90 percents do nothing useful, most expensive bureaucracy ever) and their projects. Some are good. But majority of them are unjust and stupid.
50 percents of spent money go to subvences in agriculture. We therefore block free trade. Americans dont make subvences but have to make tariffs because EU, therefore non-european farmers from poor countries dont have any chance how improve their situation. Their only worthy commodity is blocked. Africans are dying by hunger and EU as compensation will every year send some billion to their dictators. Europeans have to pay for overpriced food, overpriced because non-europeans would do it cheaper and overpriced because taxes every year are spent to agriculture. Overpriced also because people in services and high tech industry would be much more worthy than in agriculture. Such profitable agriculture also leads to side effects as deforestation. Suprised? Green lobby is irrational. They are againist geneticly modified food (finally chance to feed world), againist nuclear plants (one of most clean energy sources) and for agriculture which limits forests. Lungs of earth.
And its not only in agriculture, its in everything. I should write here later other examples, its already great that you have read my post to this point. Open eyes and you will see it by own. Blocking and tarrifs non-european products in expense of all people except European trusts.
(edited)
I and majority of my friends dont want European State. I am sure that many British, French, Swedish or Hungarians too. Thats why French and Dutch citizens refused European constitution and therefore citizens lost possibility to decide what European Union should like any more with "exception"of Irish.
One of reason is, how you said, difference of cultures. European culture was that great because was very diverse. EU is trying unify everything, and therefore we are losing own culture and getting new one. You should say thats globalization which occurs everywhere, but EU plays significant role in it. USSR tried pretty same, when you look at Eastern bloc, there were trying to make everything uniform. But valued culture came mainly from environment which was opossite and dissent.
EU often claims that its trying maintain free market and internationalism. But when I observe its development, all led to continentalism and protectionism. At the same time when they started removing barriers between EU countries, they also started making barriers towards other world. The great humanistic ideas became tool how to protect own interests. Interests which were part of nationalism didn´t disappeared, they were just maintained in whole Europe for more power. What a shame.
Now we are all paying in taxes European bureaucracy(billions just for bureaucracy which in 90 percents do nothing useful, most expensive bureaucracy ever) and their projects. Some are good. But majority of them are unjust and stupid.
50 percents of spent money go to subvences in agriculture. We therefore block free trade. Americans dont make subvences but have to make tariffs because EU, therefore non-european farmers from poor countries dont have any chance how improve their situation. Their only worthy commodity is blocked. Africans are dying by hunger and EU as compensation will every year send some billion to their dictators. Europeans have to pay for overpriced food, overpriced because non-europeans would do it cheaper and overpriced because taxes every year are spent to agriculture. Overpriced also because people in services and high tech industry would be much more worthy than in agriculture. Such profitable agriculture also leads to side effects as deforestation. Suprised? Green lobby is irrational. They are againist geneticly modified food (finally chance to feed world), againist nuclear plants (one of most clean energy sources) and for agriculture which limits forests. Lungs of earth.
And its not only in agriculture, its in everything. I should write here later other examples, its already great that you have read my post to this point. Open eyes and you will see it by own. Blocking and tarrifs non-european products in expense of all people except European trusts.
(edited)
from an economic standpoint the EU has done wonders for Europe. The major problem with the EU is the degredation of a nation's soverignty. While having a body to provide oversight throughout the continent is great, the idea of establishing a justice system is flawed, for it is impossible to create a system with ideals that every country will agree with. The establishment of the Euro is clearly a great economic tool, yet you have countries like Greece who are ultimately screwed. The question now lies in the fact that is it the place of the EU and other nation to bail Greece out of its economic problems?
The dissolution of borders is another factor I personally have a problem with. With the rise of fundamentalist groups and other radicals, along with everyday criminals it becomes much harder to track and moniter their actions. There is no trans-national police force, although Interpol is striving to become one. In any case, the establishment of trans-national and trans-continental organizations are a direct result of globalization, but as in any political move, there are opponents whose criticism are highly relevant. The loss of independence and soverignty is a major factor of dissension throughout this issue.
The dissolution of borders is another factor I personally have a problem with. With the rise of fundamentalist groups and other radicals, along with everyday criminals it becomes much harder to track and moniter their actions. There is no trans-national police force, although Interpol is striving to become one. In any case, the establishment of trans-national and trans-continental organizations are a direct result of globalization, but as in any political move, there are opponents whose criticism are highly relevant. The loss of independence and soverignty is a major factor of dissension throughout this issue.
I dont know about economical wonders, but its hard to argue either way because I dont know what would be without EU. Some countries (southern and eastern) are screwed and some others (northern and western) do well. Make me wonder if mentality has not something to do with it. Some countries made great progress (Ireland) and some stagnate (Greece), and same should be said about non-EU countries in same area. Boom as was in USA or Asian tigers is nowhere near. We compete with you only in absolute numbers, not in quality.
I consider Euro as good step, but countries like Greece should never got it with such economic policy. But how many countries in EU are without debts? Greece is just most visible, but Italy, Spain, Hungary, Latvia and some others have serious problems with their budgets...something has to change or we are going to hell. You Americans are giving it to at least to military operations againist terrorists, but we are wasting our money without any reason, just to benefit some privileged. It seems that being in EU means for some politicians lack of responsibility.
Dissolution of borders should have been another good thing, but its only nominally and security (while rightfully or unjustly) started endanger freedom. Behind boarders of new Schengen members are now patroling policemen, stoping and harassing people from bad part of Europe. EU newly established anti-riot police for fighting againist protests. I smell something fishy here.
(edited)
I consider Euro as good step, but countries like Greece should never got it with such economic policy. But how many countries in EU are without debts? Greece is just most visible, but Italy, Spain, Hungary, Latvia and some others have serious problems with their budgets...something has to change or we are going to hell. You Americans are giving it to at least to military operations againist terrorists, but we are wasting our money without any reason, just to benefit some privileged. It seems that being in EU means for some politicians lack of responsibility.
Dissolution of borders should have been another good thing, but its only nominally and security (while rightfully or unjustly) started endanger freedom. Behind boarders of new Schengen members are now patroling policemen, stoping and harassing people from bad part of Europe. EU newly established anti-riot police for fighting againist protests. I smell something fishy here.
(edited)
I can understand you, born in Ceskoslovensko, fear EU could became like USSR, but there's a big difference: we're not comunist! ;)
We don't need to make everything uniform in Europe to be a great country. And I'm thinkin about USA. Kliang can help us... I think, from east coast to west cost, from California to Texas to Florida, Haway, Alaska... there are many many differences in culture, behaviour, food, politics, economy,... But they're a real country!
I also have a very different culture from suothern Italy, and I think this is the same for Czechs and Slovaks. But the point is that this reason alone isn't enough to stop to try to make an european country.
Now Greece, Hungary, Spain and other country are in a very deep sea of shit! Next could be Italy or Germany. But we shoudn't think for a second "screw them! We won't help'em, they've to do something with their own forces". We just should make this impossible: Europe should be structured in a way that would be impossible defaults for their country, and to reduce as much as possible corruption, injustice, and so on. In USA every States have their own law, but there's also a federal law, and that's what (imho) EU lacks most of all at the moment.
We don't need to make everything uniform in Europe to be a great country. And I'm thinkin about USA. Kliang can help us... I think, from east coast to west cost, from California to Texas to Florida, Haway, Alaska... there are many many differences in culture, behaviour, food, politics, economy,... But they're a real country!
I also have a very different culture from suothern Italy, and I think this is the same for Czechs and Slovaks. But the point is that this reason alone isn't enough to stop to try to make an european country.
Now Greece, Hungary, Spain and other country are in a very deep sea of shit! Next could be Italy or Germany. But we shoudn't think for a second "screw them! We won't help'em, they've to do something with their own forces". We just should make this impossible: Europe should be structured in a way that would be impossible defaults for their country, and to reduce as much as possible corruption, injustice, and so on. In USA every States have their own law, but there's also a federal law, and that's what (imho) EU lacks most of all at the moment.
yes you are right when you say that culture, behaviour, food, politics, economy vary between states. there is also continous debate between state and federal laws here in the US. But you are over looking one HUGE factor in your argument...EUROPE ITSELF IS NOT A COUNTRY. With that in mind you cant assume that the EU would implement a trans-national law for there is no country anywhere, european or otherwise, that will allow that to happen.
It´s terribly thing! More or less I hear it from most country except east Europe. The main problem is that the countries lost their independence when they go there. And it´s crazy that you can vote time after time to get yes but then you can´t go out again!