Subject: »PIIGS - economics problems

You can add Belgium to your list.

Actually, it all depends on stability now. That would decrease the chance of speculation against the EUR countries. Kudos to Greece for fucking over the rest of the EU-countries! I really can't believe it actually, we would erase 50% of the debt they own the other countries and they don't immediately accept?

Like it's our fault they are corrupt..

And hey: sorry to all hardworking Greece and honest people, they are maybe worst off..

I dont know well the belgium situation so I didnt include it in the list ... But in some way, we are all in the same ship.
About the speculation, it's not only speculation, it's mainly offer/demand market... If investors have faith about our capacity to pay back, they will be ready to loan money with good conditions. That's the case for Germany and France today. If they do not trust the country, bond rates are increasing fast, following the notations agencies note degradation. That was the case for Greece, and now same phenomena starts in Italy, unfortunately, even if Sarkozy announced he save the world ( bullshit again ), and even before 1st minister of Greece announce a referendum : the market was not convinced that it would solve the debt issue of Italy and other fragile EU country.
France is in fragile situation today, if bond rate increase too much ( and they tends to increase since months ), the interests we pay every year will explode. And to reflect that, I would not be surprised if we lose our AAA rating in the coming weeks or months. Notation agencies started again to study ( in a negativ tendancy ) France situation.

And I dont know what told media in other country, but in France it was so basic, kind of "Sarkozy and Merkel saved the world and the Greek, and our banks are safe, woohoo" ... Load of bullshits.
Greece is still with 2 feets in the shit, and our debt is still enormeous and with no economical perspectiv to reduce it.
It was the same when they announced that banks were passing easily stress tests, do not worry, everything is going well... And Dexia ?

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the point is there..

You will see in some months that the public debate will turn in "how to find the money".
And I can anticipate the only solution they will give to feed people minds..

Long work life, privatization, less public services, worst public services, less work stability, freedom to fire, more temporarily work contract type.. and so on..

The idea international economic institution have is not a long time strategy to enforce economic base of a country (strong reddit base for feeding demand, strong productive system to get a stabile progress), but only how to maximize some little elites profict now..

While the very (very very) rich people are carefully carrying out of EU all their money and investment... you'll be paying with taxation and losing services! until the entire economic system will be compromicted..

but for that time probably someone will have found an enemy for us all to fight...

Italy a bigger threat to UK than Greece, warns FSA chairman Lord Turner]Italy a bigger threat to UK than Greece, warns FSA chairman Lord Turner
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Long work life, privatization, less public services, worst public services, less work stability, freedom to fire, more temporarily work contract type.. and so on..

- longer working: good
- privatization: good
- less public services: good
- more work flexibility: good

What's the downside here? ;-)

Btw... Why there is here that Greece problem.. Greeks can sold out half of their state assets and they can solve it "on theirs own", or not?

there is no register of immovables in Greece. They don't know what is from who :-)

- longer working: good
- privatization: good
- less public services: good
- more work flexibility: good

good for ... who??
not for me..
more to paying, more to work, for have less?
tnx no!

Good for everyone in the long term. It'll make our economies more healthy.

false. It can only can make crisis worst (it is a crisis of consume lost, not of productivity!!!!)

and by the way..
let's do like elsewere..
let's make pay someone else than me.
I did not steal anything in my life

I agree with him.

more flexibility is good for eveyone. Someone who do more than 10 year the same job, isn't motivated anymore at all. For exemple myself: I change every 3 - 5 years from company.

longer work: Now someone start work around 22, stop work around 60 and dies at 80. so that means you work 38 years and have an income from the governement during 42 years... how can that be sustained?

Less public services: countries with many officials always perform less. f.e. Greece, north korea, ex-Soviet Union, ...

privatization: public services are politically driven. Private companys are judged on results.

let's make pay someone else than me.
I did not steal anything in my life

You live as one economy. What you did, is irrelevant. You are part of Italy (if you like it or not), just like I am a part of the deep trouble called Belgium against my will, so if Italy must pay, you must pay with it. That is what democracy is all about (although Italy isn't a real democracy, just like Belgium isn't). You chose your leaders, if they mess up, you - Italy as a whole - are responsible. Your politicians messed up (120% debt), our politicians messed up, the Greek ones seriously messed up.

just study a bit of economics before posting..:

more flexibility is good for eveyone. Someone who do more than 10 year the same job, isn't motivated anymore at all. For exemple myself: I change every 3 - 5 years from company.

it's possible only for intellectual professions..
the others?

longer work: Now someone start work around 22, stop work around 60 and dies at 80. so that means you work 38 years and have an income from the governement during 42 years... how can that be sustained?

I want to ask why, if our previdential sistem is fine, and not in debt I must work more to pay debt done by stealing of politicians,
but remember that the problem is not this of productivity, the problem is the reddit lost..

Less public services: countries with many officials always perform less. f.e. Greece, north korea, ex-Soviet Union, ...

perform less?? less what??? LOL
more services are a kind of richness you can't count as exspences

privatization: public services are politically driven. Private companys are judged on results.

no, private services are judged on profit, if a service is no profitable you'll lost it..
public cost more in terms of money, but gives a lot more in terms of services..

You live as one economy. What you did, is irrelevant. You are part of Italy

I can say the same for you:
You live as one economy with us in EU. What you did, is irrelevant. You are part of EU.

You are not understanding my point.
If you say I got to pay for my politicians, why don't you have to do exactly the same..?

I want to ask why, if our previdential sistem is fine, and not in debt I must work more to pay debt done by stealing of politicians,

Because Italy elected those politicians. And in fact, even if you didn't elect them, you'd still be responsible. The citizens of a country are always financially responsible for the actions of their leaders.

perform less?? less what??? LOL
more services are a kind of richness you can't count as exspences

Services are expenses. Some expenses should not be made. For instance in Belgium, you can get an eternal unemployment fee. That is ridiculous. That's not a service, it's a cost. One we should get rid of. 2 years of unemployment fees is enough.

Services are expenses. Some expenses should not be made. For instance in Belgium, you can get an eternal unemployment fee. That is ridiculous. That's not a service, it's a cost. One we should get rid of. 2 years of unemployment fees is enough.

after reading this I understand you simply don't know what you're saying.
This crisis is not a crisis of cost, but of lost of reddit!!!
Try to understand it, then rethink tho whole thing!