Subject: Intelligent Political Discussion Thread

But look at our prisons:


Ian Huntley - killed two children and an utter prat.
He SUED the prison because he didn't get his Cadbury's Chocolate Buttons.
We aren't going to reform, and then all the human rights campaigners start a campaign for internet access, days off for good behaviour and voila!

We have what we get today. Utter tripe, I tell you.

Even though there are some cases:
i.e. A primary school teacher went on the rampage in the school with a pistol, shooting many children.

The truth is that with a good group of lawyers they can always get without it claiming some sort of psychologic problem.

i am against it for several reasons:
- The penal system is inherently flawed since at the end are controlled by humans.
- It is already probed that it does not lower the amount of crimes.
- In countries where death penalty exists, only the convicts that can't afford a good group of lawyers are sentenced to death.
- If it actually does not lower the crime rate, what other reasons do you have for killing another human? Basically the other reason is "to get what he deserves", and that is just awful and not a valid point for me.

It doesn't go straight to them, it goes to the corrupt politicians, as customs sadly dictate.

Well, if Canada can give money to the citizens of Congo, go ahead, and Belgium will pay you to give to those citizens. Problem is that ( almost ) hole Africa is as corrupt as ... yeah, there is not really something to compare with it. And I'm apologizing now to all Africans all over the world, but that's the way it is. I mean, ( almost ) all governments, policemen, ... are corrupt.

Europe extract millons worth of gold and silver from america and used that money to build the infractracture that most of Europe is enjoying now, and you don't want to pay for schools for the aboriginal kids.

I think is unfair.

By the way, where Europe is sending money to help?

Canada is giving money to the Canadian aboriginals that were oppress by the british and french.

Internet and days off? If I was the ruler, I wouldn't make that possible. No TV, no Internet, no days off ... a radio maybe and they can reed books and think about what they've done and what they've destroyed.

Voila. You give it to people in your own country, you can control that. But we can't control what happens with money sent to Congo, because otherwise, they'd say we recolonized Congo.

Oh no we don't? For the case of belgium i know we left congo with a roadnet which was one of the best in africa at that time and surely the biggest, a decent railnet, educational facilities, performing harbours,..

We left a good infrastructure there, we invested in it(of course investments to make profit but still we invested in Congo). As a proof i can tell you that many congolese people wish the belgians came back to reset an adequate government.
We were harsh at times, but fair.
We have done what we needed to do

But you keep giving money to other places where other corrup politicians take it :D

If EU want you can make a accord to buy good land for the aboriginal and build schools, etc and give them tools. But as far as I know that were never proposed to the aboriginal people in Soth America

Well, criminals that are set free are set free after long evaluation. If someone does behave good in prison he has to be rewarded for it. If someone did break rules everly and raped a girl or killed a person, he will not just be set free after some months (in no case). And he will be tested and evaluated by psychologists. If they say no go, he will just rape another girl, then it is a no go to let him out.

But well, it is true that many people think the way you said, they do this, because
a) they have no idea how the system works, so fear controls their argumentation
b) they think there will be nobody in prison for things he didn't do (well in US death row there are calculations of 10-20% innocents having to die)
c) many want to believe that people in prison are just "evil", so while justice system thinks those people can be reintegrated into society, people often do not.

I am against death sentence, I think the system works ok without it.
To add death sentence also shows that you think that in some circumstances you say that it is ok to kill someone. What imho is against human morale. But of course I understand that countries that do make war also accept death sentence. It is two sides of the same coin/morale.

Did you know poor people from Eastern Europe commit crimes here like rape and the like, just because our prisons are so cushy, and they get three square meals a day, that the standard of living is better in our prisons than out there.

I know about the infractracture, but first your king destroy the will of them, and when someone is slave is difficult to go back
Did you educate? Did you help them after that?

You may be one of the nicest of Europe, but you still enjoy the gold/silver of south america without paying anything.

This is a bold yet somewhat naive attempt to discuss politics when we know that current political issues invoke strong emotions and opinions. Here in the central publicly open forums, this should be forbidden, however sokker provides an alternative, even if a limited one.

I started a forum quite a while ago called the Freedom Forum - called so because a more lenient approach to discussions is avaialble. I realise that many might consider it a bad alternative as I am the Mod there [ ;-) ] and of course can not claim objectivity, however... Turkish, English, Irish, Italian, Belgian and other users have found it free enough to question Israelis about various subjects during the last two years.

I invite all those interested to continue the discussion regarding the latest maritime action around Gaza, even our mate charles hill, to join. If an intelligent discussion is held all are welcome. Look out for the Freedom Forum and I will sign in all applicants.

Freedom Forum
or you can just search the name in the forum search.
:)

We didn't have interests in South-America.

Jup our king was draconic, the world was angry and the king gave congo to the belgian government since then all things became more civilized.

almost all people in congo could read. We tried to help but the sovereign at that time didn't want us.
The president wanted the US to help and the prime minister the USSR.

I don't know how much gold/silver there actually was in south america and "who" enjoyed it. Well for example if there were 5 high guys in a country having all that fortune and it wasn't "spain" "france" or "england" itself that claimed and used this gold, then it is hard to legitimate official repayment from this countries to the countries that were abused.
But I think if you find enough evidence and data and sell it good and show that it is really needed, then you would stand a chance in making lots of private persons collecting money for it. :)

I mean frenchies also stole our state treasure centuries ago, but that is just nothing that we can "recollect" even if we knew if that was more than 2 cows and a sheep.