Subject: »NEWS AROUND THE WORLD

What is correct about Schepels opinion is that we would strike too. Look at the group who is targeted once again.
The group which has already lost more as 20% of their income is once more targeted.. The biggest shoulder should carry the most weight well so it isn't in Greece.

Didn't realize that until yesterday..

As a lendor, i would be more reluctant to 'support' Greece, because of its instability.

Sure, but that is irrelevant, by and large. You are thinking from the outside, with your 'own' needs in mind. You need to look at it from the inside if you want to understand it. You see, from the outside, a single economy to be saved. That is a major error. 'The economy'is the sum total of various 'markets', both in literal and a abstract sense, which are connected, but different. When you offer your labour for hire in town A, it's not for hire in town B. You could go to town B of course, but then you change markets. The sum total, 'the economy', is only directly relevant to those who operate in several or all markets at the same time. To those who don't, which usually means the vast majority, any negative impact on the sum total is relatively small as it is divided over all parts. Now, if you stand to lose a lot on your own particular position as opposed to a lesser loss, would you not strike to change that?

What it all comes down to is that Greece has been spending more than it has been earning for far too long. Now when they are basically bankrupt, the Greek are striking to preserve their current condition which was undeservedly "accomplished" to begin with. That is totally against any common sense and extremely selfish and despicable.

Note that Greece has per capita GDP almost on Germany's level!!?? That's completely undeserved and based on exagerated consumption instead of sustainable production. What the Greek are now striking for is their "acquired right" that the Germans and other EU countries keep paying for their wishes which are over their real possibilities.

I know it's difficult to take away candy from a child when he's already happily eating it but we're not talking about children here. Or are we?
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The comparison doesn't hold much water. I haven't the time to explain it any further, but I would ask you to look at what it really means to people and how the deficit came to be. Bottom line, the Greek population at large is a victim, not a perpetrator.

Seriously, I wouldn't strike. I wouldn't be happy of course, but Greece must realize they now are dependent on foreign money they'll only get when they do what IMF and European Commission orders them to do.

It is often difficult to make a difference between real victims and people who run away from responsibility and get victimized because of it. I mean, Greece is a democracy and in democracy people get the leadership they deserve. In democracy you can't say "I didn't vote for this government and so I will avoid what they do". That's not the way it works. You vote and enjoy benefits and/or suffer damage from the overall election results.

Greece government did this: Budget wasting. Another government will have to find a way out of the mess such behaviour caused and it won't be pleasant for most people. Avoiding acceptance of that fact is childish and leading to further decadence. Simple as that.

They are indeed a victim. However, they are a victim of their own choice (they have elected the parliament). The Greek have lived beyond their means, and now they must realize they all have to bear the consequences of that. Of course, this will be worse for relative poor people than for relative rich people, and therefore, the strongest shoulders should bear the greatest burden, however, you cannot reform the Greek economy without affecting the 'normal Greek'.

What is correct about Schepels opinion is that we would strike too. Look at the group who is targeted once again.
The group which has already lost more as 20% of their income is once more targeted.. The biggest shoulder should carry the most weight well so it isn't in Greece.

Didn't realize that until yesterday..

First of all, there a number of countries in Eastern Europe that have a flat tax rate (so everyone pays the same percentage of taxes).

However, not paying your taxes and striking (which includes violence, which is a crime) is not helping the Greek state to survive.

Hey, we're on the same track here. :)
Was this an addition to my post or you didn't read it before writing this?

Didn't read it, was typing while you posted it.
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So we finally found a topic to mostly agree with each other. ;)

I think we have quite some topics we agree, but religion is just not one of them ;-)

This argument is a fallacy. You can't be hold responsible if the people on top deceive everyone in sight. Remember, politicians *lied* about the state of affairs. People voted based on lies. It's not so easy, not so black and white as you and Rubinho seem to believe. It's also incredibly easy to say what you would or wouldn't do if you're in your chair behind your screen.

Please do keep in mind I want to give you guys a different perspective. This isn't about right or wrong, but about the WHY. (At least, as far as I am concerned.)

Didn't you once say that the people are always financially responsible for what their country does?

No, you're simply not right. Today people are concerned mostly about their rights and they couldn't care less about their obligations and responsibilities. The Greek have to be generally thankful to their historical leaders for getting them to be in the top 10% of the world countries by their general economic wellbeing.

So, they had some bad luck with their choices lately. So what? You win some, you lose some. At least they got to choose. So, they chose liars. Better luck next time. Maybe they were choosing those who were telling them what they wanted to hear. And maybe now they're angry to finally have to listen to those who got the dirty job of telling them the truth.

It's nice to see people talking about what is good for us while you don't live here
Keep up

The Greek goverment crossed over the red line yesterday,there will be consequences for them.Severe consequences
Rubinho,i told you the last time we spoke in this topic that the plan was going to fail and guess what,it did
And the new one is going to fail for sure,it's only half measures
Driving people to poverty never helped a country produse money to pay back its loans

So keep up and continue believing that we are lazy and we like to strike :)