Subject: »NEWS AROUND THE WORLD

In EU are majority religion Christianity and more than 50% people called themselves Christians.

maybe in theory.

from what I see, most people are just labelled Christian.

I'm officially a Catholic, but I don't believe in God. It would be very time consuming to leave the church and I don't really care that much for my 'label'. The thing is, in statistics I'm part of the 'Catholic' majority.

I would love to see some kind of religion tax [instead of 'all people' money going to church, only those religious would have to pay]. I wonder how many people would consider them as religious then:)

me too :-)

but anyway... we have here some religion, that evil muslims dont care how strong believers we are :-DDD

if there is church tax..... Christianity would drop from maybe 70% to 20% :-D

if there is church tax..... Christianity would drop from maybe 70% to 20% :-D

I don't see a problem with that. The more people stop believing in fairy tales the better.

Powerful people don't want clever people ;-)

Nobody sees a problem with that except for church.

How do you think, why is it hard to leave the church in official manner? Because they need public money and virtual public backing for their political causes.

In my whole family I know one person who frequently visites church, my grandmother. The rest? Meh. Not openly non-religious, but I would say pro-religion, anti-church.

If it so so easy..why nobody did it :-)?


In my whole family I know one person who frequently visites church, my grandmother. The rest? Meh. Not openly non-religious, but I would say pro-religion, anti-church.

If there is real chance to set up church tax... any party who promise that will be against it will get 20% votes. (no matter or their program !!!! ).
So, we have here that famous system called "democracy", you had to accept what people want :-) !

If it so so easy..why nobody did it :-)?

nobody messes with the mafia ;-P

also ther are always many right wing conservative parties that will not agree to this as it would go against what they are claiming.

plus, raising the religion card is always a big risk. it's easy to argument againt it, it's hard to argument for it with simple words [people don't like to hear about the economy etc., they prefer fights over abortion/euthanasia/homosexualism etc.]

I'm officially a Catholic, but I don't believe in God. It would be very time consuming to leave the church and I don't really care that much for my 'label'. The thing is, in statistics I'm part of the 'Catholic' majority.

Well, I did the effort to scrap myself from the baptize register. Because I so convincingly despise everything that has to do with the immoral catholicism. And one can - according to the catholic church - not be unbaptized ("Once god accepted you as his child, he cannot undo so.") . Being scrapped from the baptize register is all I can do.

I would love to see some kind of religion tax [instead of 'all people' money going to church, only those religious would have to pay]. I wonder how many people would consider them as religious then:)

I agree. But then you should also have a clause in which one can chose whether one wants to see money go to culture. Or to the army (a pacifist might object). Or to welfare. It's bullshit to only apply this logic to religion. "But everyone chooses his own religion!" Yes, but everyone chooses the sort of culture he goes to too.

Edit: And my parents know I blame them for having me baptized. I've told them it is morally unacceptable to baptize a kid. Just like I told my sister when she got her daughter baptized.
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I agree. But then you should also have a clause in which one can chose whether one wants to see money go to culture. Or to the army (a pacifist might object). Or to welfare. It's bullshit to only apply this logic to religion. "But everyone chooses his own religion!" Yes, but everyone chooses the sort of culture he goes to too.

I'm only saying that it would be the best possible indicator of country's real 'religiousness'. :)

I would love to see some kind of religion tax [instead of 'all people' money going to church, only those religious would have to pay]

That's the situation in Germany. I don't know when it started or what happened immediately after introducing it, though. Wikipedia reports 34% of the population with no stated religion. I don't know the numbers for other countries.

...just heard yanukovich's speech to the (russian people!) sorry "the world", to justify Putin's actions... have't heard so much nonsense in a long time. "Its the fascist opposition which attaked its people" - no. "He didn't flee Ukraine" said Yanukovich from Russia, he signed a treaty on on 22 feburary, only to say now that the other side didn't keep their side of the bargain (which is not true) so, that means he is still in command of the army, and the country, despite.. that he has no other support except from Putin's russian soldiers. :-] aaaa!! so much misinformation and hypocricy, its unbelievable. Also he tried to tell USA what they can and cannot do, which sounds like a fallen son teaching his father how to make babies... aaa!!

+

I made a little map of the current military situation (according to news) blue NATO, Red=Russia, orange = pro-russian so called "unknown separatists". ... come on.. :]


and one extremely important fact:
In the Crimea 41% are russian citizens.
The 58.3% are people with their first langueage Russian so called "ethnic-russian" of which about 17.5% are actually Ukrainian citizens. This is the number often used as the justification of the pro-russian side, who want to join russia, or rather russian propaganda which wants everyone to believe tehy do, its often risen to 75%?!?. As for all russians speakers (ukrainian, russian, and all others) its 91% in crimea. This definatly doesn't mean they are all pro russian! :-] The important fact its that ITS LESS THAN HALF (41% of Russian's which are the so called reason for Putins's occupation), not 60% or 75%. - which unfortunatlely is the current populist view (due to soviet type propaganda).

Considering the stories about "russian buses, of tourists", the fast-track russian citizenship give out, and the stories of stealing ukrainia's passports (in the excuse for the refferendum check) its all becoming more clear... :-]
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so much misinformation and hypocricy, its unbelievable.
He said just formal facts :-). If there is constitution and rules, he is still the president and has formal power in his hands. The fact we dont like him (me too, hi is a dick :-D) can not change the facts :-)

If constitution can be changed only by several hundreds of people and not by majority in parliament, they should not use democracy, anarchy would be better for them.

somebody should find solid stats.... and then we can discuss.

What I could see in TV or youtube is people saying "Russia", I dont see a lot of people saying "ukraine!" on the Crimea.

we will see it in referendum ! I just hope if not more than half will be pro russia, I hope Crimea will maybe get autonomy but will not be part of Russia. And I hope that they will allow OBSE people to monitor referendum.

The 58.3% are people with their first langueage Russian so called "ethnic-russian" of which about 17.5% are actually Ukrainian citizens.

You're right when saying that not all Russian-speaking Ukrainian citizens want Ukraine to be a part of Russia (or the part of Ukraine where they live). However, citizenship does not say a thing. They've got a Ukrainian passport because they lived in Ukraine after the break-up of the Soviet Union. The language they speak at home is probably a better indicator to which sociological group they belong to or identify themselves with than citizenship. And it is safe to assume that the Russian-speaking sociological group is more favorable towards annexation of Ukraine (or parts of it) by Russia than the Ukrainian-speaking sociological group.

(And no, I'm not saying that there are two clear sociological groups. Probably, most Ukrainian citizens are not entirely 'within' one of those two groups.)

What I could see in TV or youtube is people saying "Russia", I dont see a lot of people saying "ukraine!" on the Crimea.

considering that there are Russian soldiers around, would you be so eager to run around yelling 'Ukraine'?