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Subject: »NEWS AROUND THE WORLD
What is the point? All that is said about the pro Russian separatists is lies (because you support these pro Russian separatists) but everything bad about the other side (which you don't support) is true? Hope you aren't going to claim such complete nonsense, that would really make you a joker.
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I agree.
This is the shit now in east-Ukraine. And it's a shame two population so close to each other (russian and ukrainian) now hate so badly :(
And that's no surprise to me, when a regular elected and non-empeached president has been kicked-out by some far-right fanatics who enjoy to march with torches in the night, with the goose-step, using some esoteric symbols, and killing and beating everyone doesn't fully support their purposes.
And yes, shit is both side right now. Do I ever said something different?
This is the shit now in east-Ukraine. And it's a shame two population so close to each other (russian and ukrainian) now hate so badly :(
And that's no surprise to me, when a regular elected and non-empeached president has been kicked-out by some far-right fanatics who enjoy to march with torches in the night, with the goose-step, using some esoteric symbols, and killing and beating everyone doesn't fully support their purposes.
And yes, shit is both side right now. Do I ever said something different?
Yes, even right now. Nazis kicked out the beloved ukrainean president, so Russia f'cked up Ukraine and annexed Crimeea to protect russian population. Does it make any sense?
And yes, shit is both side right now. Do I ever said something different?
You just refuse to post the complete story, never something bad about pro Russian separatists and Russia. So yes, indirectly you absolutely do!
two population
2 populations?? Are you talking about Ukraine and Ukrainians? Russians live in Russia, Ukrainians in Ukraine (except for some immigrants, but that's really a small minority). And if you want to talk about hate, blame Russia and there propaganda war. Besides, Russia was already involved before it all exploded into violance. The russianisation of regions is a slow proces; propoganda, indoctrination and taking control of power and even control of foreign regions takes time, like for example buying presidents and destabilize regions followed by an invasion and illegal annexation.
And again the rest of your post is totally one-sided and without a bad word about pro Russian separatists and Russia.
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You just refuse to post the complete story, never something bad about pro Russian separatists and Russia. So yes, indirectly you absolutely do!
two population
2 populations?? Are you talking about Ukraine and Ukrainians? Russians live in Russia, Ukrainians in Ukraine (except for some immigrants, but that's really a small minority). And if you want to talk about hate, blame Russia and there propaganda war. Besides, Russia was already involved before it all exploded into violance. The russianisation of regions is a slow proces; propoganda, indoctrination and taking control of power and even control of foreign regions takes time, like for example buying presidents and destabilize regions followed by an invasion and illegal annexation.
And again the rest of your post is totally one-sided and without a bad word about pro Russian separatists and Russia.
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2 populations?? Are you talking about Ukraine and Ukrainians? Russians live in Russia, Ukrainians in Ukraine (except for some immigrants, but that's really a small minority).
Demographics of Ukraine
Census 2001
Ukrainians 37,541,693 - 77.5%
Russians 8,334,141 - 17.2%
Then, what I had to say I said.
I just suggest to comment what I say, not what I don't say.
Demographics of Ukraine
Census 2001
Ukrainians 37,541,693 - 77.5%
Russians 8,334,141 - 17.2%
Then, what I had to say I said.
I just suggest to comment what I say, not what I don't say.
These numbers can mean everything or nothing at all. For me it's important what pasport someone has + what the country of birth is.
I just suggest to comment what I say, not what I don't say.
Others also already told you it is very clear which side you support. You only tell a one-sided story, absolutely nothing bad about the pro Russian separatists and Russia part. You can stop that show, it's clear, very clear.
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I just suggest to comment what I say, not what I don't say.
Others also already told you it is very clear which side you support. You only tell a one-sided story, absolutely nothing bad about the pro Russian separatists and Russia part. You can stop that show, it's clear, very clear.
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absolutely nothing bad about the pro Russian separatists and Russia part.
maybe, but for that there already are the main stream media.
maybe, but for that there already are the main stream media.
I just suggest to comment what I say, not what I don't say.
But it's more interesting, what you don't say. What you do is manipulation. Like this:
when a regular elected and non-empeached president has been kicked-out by some far-right fanatics
Maidan wasn't far-rightist, there were far-rightists at Maidan. That's a big difference. Poroshenko isn't far-rightist either. Basically it's true that there were some far-rightist fanatics, what you avoid to mention (and that's the important part) is that the vast majority wasn't like that.
And that's no surprise to me, when a...
What do you mean by this? Is it the natural and accepted thing to do, and the only possibility in this case to create a small totalitarian dictatorship using Soviet communist symbols (like "people's republic" and the KGB insignia)?
Because I was sympathising with the Russian demonstrators in Eastern-Ukraine in the first days. If some idiot wants to take away your right to speak your mother language, than something has to be done. But that doesn't necessarily mean this, and that was not the only option.
But it's more interesting, what you don't say. What you do is manipulation. Like this:
when a regular elected and non-empeached president has been kicked-out by some far-right fanatics
Maidan wasn't far-rightist, there were far-rightists at Maidan. That's a big difference. Poroshenko isn't far-rightist either. Basically it's true that there were some far-rightist fanatics, what you avoid to mention (and that's the important part) is that the vast majority wasn't like that.
And that's no surprise to me, when a...
What do you mean by this? Is it the natural and accepted thing to do, and the only possibility in this case to create a small totalitarian dictatorship using Soviet communist symbols (like "people's republic" and the KGB insignia)?
Because I was sympathising with the Russian demonstrators in Eastern-Ukraine in the first days. If some idiot wants to take away your right to speak your mother language, than something has to be done. But that doesn't necessarily mean this, and that was not the only option.
when a regular elected and non-empeached president has been kicked-out by some far-right fanatics
Maidan wasn't far-rightist, there were far-rightists at Maidan. That's a big difference. Poroshenko isn't far-rightist either. Basically it's true that there were some far-rightist fanatics, what you avoid to mention (and that's the important part) is that the vast majority wasn't like that.
I never denied a vast portion of the ukrainian people (majority?) want to join EU. But the maidan moviment couldn't kick Yanukovich without the support of the extremists. And is out of doubt he was fair elected and wasn't empeached. He just had to run for his life. So or the whole Euromaidan was extremist (but I dont' think so), or some "far-rightrist fanatic" violated the constitution to kick out the president.
What do you mean by this? Is it the natural and accepted thing to do, and the only possibility in this case to create a small totalitarian dictatorship using Soviet communist symbols (like "people's republic" and the KGB insignia)?
No, I mean it was quite easy to foresee the link action/reaction. Just like it's easy to foresee an attack by a bear if you tease him with a stick.
Does it make acceptable all the violations of the law in east-Ukraine? Of course not. But imho the main guilty is in the pro-western side.
Maidan wasn't far-rightist, there were far-rightists at Maidan. That's a big difference. Poroshenko isn't far-rightist either. Basically it's true that there were some far-rightist fanatics, what you avoid to mention (and that's the important part) is that the vast majority wasn't like that.
I never denied a vast portion of the ukrainian people (majority?) want to join EU. But the maidan moviment couldn't kick Yanukovich without the support of the extremists. And is out of doubt he was fair elected and wasn't empeached. He just had to run for his life. So or the whole Euromaidan was extremist (but I dont' think so), or some "far-rightrist fanatic" violated the constitution to kick out the president.
What do you mean by this? Is it the natural and accepted thing to do, and the only possibility in this case to create a small totalitarian dictatorship using Soviet communist symbols (like "people's republic" and the KGB insignia)?
No, I mean it was quite easy to foresee the link action/reaction. Just like it's easy to foresee an attack by a bear if you tease him with a stick.
Does it make acceptable all the violations of the law in east-Ukraine? Of course not. But imho the main guilty is in the pro-western side.
For me it's important what pasport someone has + what the country of birth is.
interesting point of view. it sounds like minorities haven't the right to exist: if you were born in a country you have to conform to the majority of the citizens or expat!
I think that the german speaking people of Sudtirol (an italian region) will be very happy to be forced to expat to germany (or osterreich) or conform to Italy. if I remember well it happened during the Fascist era. sounds pretty democratic...
and what about Belgium? is it a Walloon or a Flemish country?
interesting point of view. it sounds like minorities haven't the right to exist: if you were born in a country you have to conform to the majority of the citizens or expat!
I think that the german speaking people of Sudtirol (an italian region) will be very happy to be forced to expat to germany (or osterreich) or conform to Italy. if I remember well it happened during the Fascist era. sounds pretty democratic...
and what about Belgium? is it a Walloon or a Flemish country?
I never said minorities don't have the right to exist, and I also never said that all people in a country should speak 1 language. Please don't change my words like that. I will leave that weak 'Fascist' comment for what it is, it's not even worth my time!
And what about Belgium? It is a federal state, but if you look at the passport of someone from Wallonia or Flanders, they are all Belgians, not Russians .... :/
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And what about Belgium? It is a federal state, but if you look at the passport of someone from Wallonia or Flanders, they are all Belgians, not Russians .... :/
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He just had to run for his life.
He would be taken to the court, like criminals are supposed to be. Because he is one. Of course most of the political elite of Ukraine are criminals, Poroshenko too. And I think Timoshenko could stay in prison too for a few more years. Of course politicians rarely get caught, but that doesn't mean the people should be sheep and they should just accept that the leaders can do anything. Even the people of Eastern-Ukraine don't accept Yanukovich anymore.
No, I mean it was quite easy to foresee the link action/reaction.
So what's your problem, with the Ukrainian attacks on rebel occupied cities? If a totalitarian dictatorship is the only possible answer to the revolution of the other political side, then it shouldn't be surprising, that if rebels occupy cities by force, then the army will attack those cities also by force.
Also, it seems to me that many people say, this was a well-foreseeable chain reaction, and the only possible outcome (just like teasing a bear with a stick). But why do you think Maidan started everything (or anything at all)? Years earlier Yanukovich had put Timoshenko into jail for corruption, and after that he did exactly the same thing in humongous volumes, knowing that Ukrainians already had an orange revolution before, against the previous corrupt leader. Wasn't that part of the same chain-reaction? Wasn't Maidan inevitable? Only the Russian reaction was?
He would be taken to the court, like criminals are supposed to be. Because he is one. Of course most of the political elite of Ukraine are criminals, Poroshenko too. And I think Timoshenko could stay in prison too for a few more years. Of course politicians rarely get caught, but that doesn't mean the people should be sheep and they should just accept that the leaders can do anything. Even the people of Eastern-Ukraine don't accept Yanukovich anymore.
No, I mean it was quite easy to foresee the link action/reaction.
So what's your problem, with the Ukrainian attacks on rebel occupied cities? If a totalitarian dictatorship is the only possible answer to the revolution of the other political side, then it shouldn't be surprising, that if rebels occupy cities by force, then the army will attack those cities also by force.
Also, it seems to me that many people say, this was a well-foreseeable chain reaction, and the only possible outcome (just like teasing a bear with a stick). But why do you think Maidan started everything (or anything at all)? Years earlier Yanukovich had put Timoshenko into jail for corruption, and after that he did exactly the same thing in humongous volumes, knowing that Ukrainians already had an orange revolution before, against the previous corrupt leader. Wasn't that part of the same chain-reaction? Wasn't Maidan inevitable? Only the Russian reaction was?
Why do you think Maidan started everything (or anything at all)?
No doubt there are a lot of people really tired of corruption, injustice and poorness.
But the main reason maidan started is the western propaganda that make belive ukrainian people they can join EU, the beautiful, peaceful, just, open, free, friendly and rich Europe.
Just like the previous orange revolution worked very well... some fake ong make some fake video like this one
And then we found basically those are Soros financed videos with the sole will to destabilize a region.
Am I delirious saying that? Maybe, but even BBC must agree with me if pubblish an article like this one: #BBCtrending: 'I am a Ukrainian' protest video goes viral
In the three months since the start of the Ukraine crisis, there have been countless videos uploaded to YouTube. But none has had anything like the impact of a video called "I am a Ukrainian"
Then we had dozens and dozens of foreign politicians - high ranked and even prime ministers and/or heads of states - going directly to the Maidan haranguing the crowd, saying them "OK! Move on! Continue! Cut of your president!"
As far as I know, those foreigners politicians include a lot of eastern Europe (expecially from Poland and baltic countries) and even high ranked EU politicians, like the European Parliament's VP - the italian Gianni Pittella, from the democratic party.
And remember, the whole thing started when Yanukovich was about to dismiss some of the european agreements and join the euro-asiatic union, with Russia, Belarus, Kazak, Kirgyz and Armenia...
Can someone figure Putin, Lavrov or Medvedev speak in fron of the spanish "indignados" or the greek protesters and saying "Go on! Fuck your presidents! You're inspiring the whole world!" ???
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No doubt there are a lot of people really tired of corruption, injustice and poorness.
But the main reason maidan started is the western propaganda that make belive ukrainian people they can join EU, the beautiful, peaceful, just, open, free, friendly and rich Europe.
Just like the previous orange revolution worked very well... some fake ong make some fake video like this one
And then we found basically those are Soros financed videos with the sole will to destabilize a region.
Am I delirious saying that? Maybe, but even BBC must agree with me if pubblish an article like this one: #BBCtrending: 'I am a Ukrainian' protest video goes viral
In the three months since the start of the Ukraine crisis, there have been countless videos uploaded to YouTube. But none has had anything like the impact of a video called "I am a Ukrainian"
Then we had dozens and dozens of foreign politicians - high ranked and even prime ministers and/or heads of states - going directly to the Maidan haranguing the crowd, saying them "OK! Move on! Continue! Cut of your president!"
As far as I know, those foreigners politicians include a lot of eastern Europe (expecially from Poland and baltic countries) and even high ranked EU politicians, like the European Parliament's VP - the italian Gianni Pittella, from the democratic party.
And remember, the whole thing started when Yanukovich was about to dismiss some of the european agreements and join the euro-asiatic union, with Russia, Belarus, Kazak, Kirgyz and Armenia...
Can someone figure Putin, Lavrov or Medvedev speak in fron of the spanish "indignados" or the greek protesters and saying "Go on! Fuck your presidents! You're inspiring the whole world!" ???
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He just had to run for his life.
He would be taken to the court, like criminals are supposed to be.
No, as I said, he wasn't even empeached. To do such a thing, accordin to the ukrainian constitution, a qualified majority of the 75% of the MPs is needed. And the votation never reached this level.
That's why we're just in front of a coup.
He would be taken to the court, like criminals are supposed to be.
No, as I said, he wasn't even empeached. To do such a thing, accordin to the ukrainian constitution, a qualified majority of the 75% of the MPs is needed. And the votation never reached this level.
That's why we're just in front of a coup.
But the main reason maidan started is the western propaganda that make belive ukrainian people they can join EU
No, primarily the fact of the negotiations made people believe they can join the EU, not the Western propaganda. And Ukrainian leadership was campaigning with EU membership. Even Yanukovich somewhat. So it's not very surprising that people get annoyed when a corrupt leader suddenly decides against the EU-pact after so many promises.
And then we found basically those are Soros financed videos with the sole will to destabilize a region.
When those videos appeared Maidan was there for months already, and it was at the final stage. That "I am Ukrainian" video was meant for the international public and not for the Ukrainians anyway. Foreign politicians also arrived at the last stage.
Can someone figure Putin, Lavrov or Medvedev speak in fron of the spanish "indignados" or the greek protesters and saying
Of course not. Dictatorship is not a popular thing, and Russia isn't known for it's welfare state either. Nobody prohibits Putin to make speeches in Europe, it's just that the party which he would openly support would lose a huge amount of it's votes. They probably sponsor European far-rightist parties, but those deny the link.
Also it's the primary pro-Russian argument, that opposition leaders made a pact, but Maidan didn't keep it. If the West was controlling everything, then why did they try to force a pact with Yanukovich on Maidan, then later make Maidan brake it? What is the logic behind this?
If Maidan would accept the pact, they could have an election in September with probably a pro-EU winner, who could restart the negotiations. But they didn't accept it, because it was corruption they were after, and they wanted to punish the corrupt politician instead of watching how the two corrupt sides make a fool out of the people again (of course they did it anyway).
No, primarily the fact of the negotiations made people believe they can join the EU, not the Western propaganda. And Ukrainian leadership was campaigning with EU membership. Even Yanukovich somewhat. So it's not very surprising that people get annoyed when a corrupt leader suddenly decides against the EU-pact after so many promises.
And then we found basically those are Soros financed videos with the sole will to destabilize a region.
When those videos appeared Maidan was there for months already, and it was at the final stage. That "I am Ukrainian" video was meant for the international public and not for the Ukrainians anyway. Foreign politicians also arrived at the last stage.
Can someone figure Putin, Lavrov or Medvedev speak in fron of the spanish "indignados" or the greek protesters and saying
Of course not. Dictatorship is not a popular thing, and Russia isn't known for it's welfare state either. Nobody prohibits Putin to make speeches in Europe, it's just that the party which he would openly support would lose a huge amount of it's votes. They probably sponsor European far-rightist parties, but those deny the link.
Also it's the primary pro-Russian argument, that opposition leaders made a pact, but Maidan didn't keep it. If the West was controlling everything, then why did they try to force a pact with Yanukovich on Maidan, then later make Maidan brake it? What is the logic behind this?
If Maidan would accept the pact, they could have an election in September with probably a pro-EU winner, who could restart the negotiations. But they didn't accept it, because it was corruption they were after, and they wanted to punish the corrupt politician instead of watching how the two corrupt sides make a fool out of the people again (of course they did it anyway).
No, as I said, he wasn't even empeached. [...] That's why we're just in front of a coup.
Coup or revolution is like talking about the rebels as terrorists or freedom fighters. The parliament isn't the primary place of action in any cases. The parliament tried to follow the situation though.
http://english.cntv.cn/program/newshour/20140222/102410.shtml
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/europe/2014/02/ukraine-parliament-ousts-president-yanukovich-2014222152035601620.html
But I don't think that the 1.5% that was missing is really relevant. It just makes ammunition for Russian propaganda, but I don't think they would care if the the imeachment reaches the 75%.
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Coup or revolution is like talking about the rebels as terrorists or freedom fighters. The parliament isn't the primary place of action in any cases. The parliament tried to follow the situation though.
http://english.cntv.cn/program/newshour/20140222/102410.shtml
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/europe/2014/02/ukraine-parliament-ousts-president-yanukovich-2014222152035601620.html
But I don't think that the 1.5% that was missing is really relevant. It just makes ammunition for Russian propaganda, but I don't think they would care if the the imeachment reaches the 75%.
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