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Subject: Catching up with the top sides
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strider80 [del] to
All
I posted something like this in the Premier League Forum, but thought it was worth opening out to everyone to see how they feel.
As I'm now more than halfway through a thoroughly unenjoyable, unproductive season in the Premier League, I've had a chance to look at the ability of the top sides. I see absolutely no way of ever catching up to that any time soon - in fact, I'm unsure I ever could, without pretty much going into hiding for ages and building up a fortune to have a short term stab at it.
Does everyone feel that the way teams are able to sustain success in this game without having to utterly sacrifice economy considerations (I'm not saying it's been easy, but that it's achievable) is the best way for this game to be? I understand that it makes it more realistic, but it seems to me there'll be no real challengers outside of the top 5 or so clubs for the trophies for years. Unless the managers at that level decide to chuck it, it's hard to imagine other clubs really breaking in to that monopoly.
This isn't purely down to my inability to get a point this season - I knew fine well I had been promoted far too early - but just a general observation. Teams that I feel I'm miles away from are regularly hopping between First and Premier Division status or playing in playoffs to stay in the top league. The top sides seem able to improve at a steady rate, making catching them very difficult indeed.
I do agree that those managers who have invested real time and energy deserve the rewards of that, and as I said earlier they also deserve recognition for achieving that balance between a good side and a steady balance sheet, but I do worry that other managers may find this discouraging and eventually just quit the game.
I know it's defeatist, and I know that some will say "these sides were at your level one day, so you can get there eventually". Maybe I'm just not good enough at this game, I don't know. Does anyone share this sort of view?
As I'm now more than halfway through a thoroughly unenjoyable, unproductive season in the Premier League, I've had a chance to look at the ability of the top sides. I see absolutely no way of ever catching up to that any time soon - in fact, I'm unsure I ever could, without pretty much going into hiding for ages and building up a fortune to have a short term stab at it.
Does everyone feel that the way teams are able to sustain success in this game without having to utterly sacrifice economy considerations (I'm not saying it's been easy, but that it's achievable) is the best way for this game to be? I understand that it makes it more realistic, but it seems to me there'll be no real challengers outside of the top 5 or so clubs for the trophies for years. Unless the managers at that level decide to chuck it, it's hard to imagine other clubs really breaking in to that monopoly.
This isn't purely down to my inability to get a point this season - I knew fine well I had been promoted far too early - but just a general observation. Teams that I feel I'm miles away from are regularly hopping between First and Premier Division status or playing in playoffs to stay in the top league. The top sides seem able to improve at a steady rate, making catching them very difficult indeed.
I do agree that those managers who have invested real time and energy deserve the rewards of that, and as I said earlier they also deserve recognition for achieving that balance between a good side and a steady balance sheet, but I do worry that other managers may find this discouraging and eventually just quit the game.
I know it's defeatist, and I know that some will say "these sides were at your level one day, so you can get there eventually". Maybe I'm just not good enough at this game, I don't know. Does anyone share this sort of view?
I totally disagree. You promoted too early for sure, but ofcourse its possible to catch up.
My first season in this SPL I finished 5th then steadily improved. It took a long long time to get the team I have now. Some of the my best players I trained from scratch, e.g. Nevis, Nesbit and a short time ago Craig (although not from total scratch as I bought him). Now Im on my 2nd batch if you like, but they are not as good and won't get to the same level, but I reckon I can still make good use from at least 3 of them again in the first 11.
Some you have to buy and some I have aren't all that great but do a job.
It is hard to maintain the strength of a team in this game. Suttie is winning the league this season but his fans are furious due to a couple of mistakes, thats gonna hit his sponser money hard. And will be difficult to recover from.
If you buy a top quality player non trainee player, the longer you keep the more you will loose on the re-sale. This is normal. And means to keep things going you have to get the best out of your trainees.
The top 5 in the SPL are pretty damn good. East Stirlingshire are steadily improving as are other teams in and out of the SPL. It takes a lot of time, and it should.
From scratch I reckon 7 to 10 seasons is enough time to get a top quality team. Provided you had the knowledge at the start, most newbs will take a few seasons to work out what there doing so. Maybe 9-12 is more realistic.
My team, I think suttie's and others too has developed very slowly in the last 5 seasons say. At a certain point improvements get harder.
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My first season in this SPL I finished 5th then steadily improved. It took a long long time to get the team I have now. Some of the my best players I trained from scratch, e.g. Nevis, Nesbit and a short time ago Craig (although not from total scratch as I bought him). Now Im on my 2nd batch if you like, but they are not as good and won't get to the same level, but I reckon I can still make good use from at least 3 of them again in the first 11.
Some you have to buy and some I have aren't all that great but do a job.
It is hard to maintain the strength of a team in this game. Suttie is winning the league this season but his fans are furious due to a couple of mistakes, thats gonna hit his sponser money hard. And will be difficult to recover from.
If you buy a top quality player non trainee player, the longer you keep the more you will loose on the re-sale. This is normal. And means to keep things going you have to get the best out of your trainees.
The top 5 in the SPL are pretty damn good. East Stirlingshire are steadily improving as are other teams in and out of the SPL. It takes a lot of time, and it should.
From scratch I reckon 7 to 10 seasons is enough time to get a top quality team. Provided you had the knowledge at the start, most newbs will take a few seasons to work out what there doing so. Maybe 9-12 is more realistic.
My team, I think suttie's and others too has developed very slowly in the last 5 seasons say. At a certain point improvements get harder.
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With the recent (few seasons ago) fan mood update. Its made it harder for teams at the top and easier for teams on the up. No question about that.
Dandy's nailed it. The secret, if there is a secret is long term training, get them young and train them forever :)
The perfect example is neither St Johnstone nor Tartan Terrors (who both have trained long and wisely) but the team currently sitting in 3rd place. Bruce City.
Bruce City beat the terrors 8-4 in a cracking match on Sunday and done so with 6 ageing Scots, 5 of whom have been capped,and all of whom graduated from their own youth school. Looking even closer we can see that Scotta joined sokker in April 2005 and to this day has only made 14 incoming transfers, quite an incredible feat.
The perfect example is neither St Johnstone nor Tartan Terrors (who both have trained long and wisely) but the team currently sitting in 3rd place. Bruce City.
Bruce City beat the terrors 8-4 in a cracking match on Sunday and done so with 6 ageing Scots, 5 of whom have been capped,and all of whom graduated from their own youth school. Looking even closer we can see that Scotta joined sokker in April 2005 and to this day has only made 14 incoming transfers, quite an incredible feat.
Exactly, good example and proves my point I think. The Gyspie lad was another good example and deezi has done similar job. Can be done.
i lost 23 fans this week!!!! and my last home match my stadium was only 1 third full.... my team is in free fall!!!
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I lost 2 fans last week, even though I lost only 1-0 to the top team in the league. It's ridiculous.
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