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Subject: [GD] Most expected changes
Most effective way to deal with daytrading is additional taxes.
For example, you can sell 10 players per season with normal tax 2,5 % and then every other player will be taxed +5%, with maximum tax 50%.
For example, you can sell 10 players per season with normal tax 2,5 % and then every other player will be taxed +5%, with maximum tax 50%.
The desire for the profit is the very core of the market system.
Managers in real life must always think about profit to keep the club alive and to achieve goals.
If they receive extraordinary offer, they will sell their player even after a season or even half a season. (that doesnt mean that this should be restriction in sokker. Player in real life can be injured for half a season or whole season - that would be 56-112 days of injury in sokker - or he can even decide to end his career - do you want this in sokker? the game must be fun, not a real life simulator).
In Czech Republic we have only very little money from TV rights and sponsors. Whole economic existence of teams in first division is based on profit from players sales and for few top teams also profit from european cups which is highly irregular. That is why the best and most promising players often leave the club, because the club cannot afford to miss the opportunity to sell them for a good offer.
In other words, young players are being bought with the intention of selling them for big money. They are sometimes willing to transfer very soon if they feel they will have a good conditions in a new club. But again, this is just a game. Player here cannot say that he doesnt want to go to the buyer because he plays 4th division only. Highest bid wins.
I am against regular daytrading in terms of regularly selling players in just matter of days or two weeks. But sometimes you get an opportunity to make a fast profit and this is perfectly right. And to make sure this is not repeated on very regular basis but only rare occassion, there is already limitation rule, that on normal occassion works perfectly. Show me a single team you would call a daytrader that ruins the game (as you say) who doesnt play arcade matches. Good luck with searching.
About TPA. As it was mentioned, the nature of market system is about different prices for similar players. Sometimes players go for big bargain, sometimes they go are big robberies. That is perfectly normal. The work for admins is to recognize when there was a cheating involved. And this must always be judged case by case, never automatically.
Managers in real life must always think about profit to keep the club alive and to achieve goals.
If they receive extraordinary offer, they will sell their player even after a season or even half a season. (that doesnt mean that this should be restriction in sokker. Player in real life can be injured for half a season or whole season - that would be 56-112 days of injury in sokker - or he can even decide to end his career - do you want this in sokker? the game must be fun, not a real life simulator).
In Czech Republic we have only very little money from TV rights and sponsors. Whole economic existence of teams in first division is based on profit from players sales and for few top teams also profit from european cups which is highly irregular. That is why the best and most promising players often leave the club, because the club cannot afford to miss the opportunity to sell them for a good offer.
In other words, young players are being bought with the intention of selling them for big money. They are sometimes willing to transfer very soon if they feel they will have a good conditions in a new club. But again, this is just a game. Player here cannot say that he doesnt want to go to the buyer because he plays 4th division only. Highest bid wins.
I am against regular daytrading in terms of regularly selling players in just matter of days or two weeks. But sometimes you get an opportunity to make a fast profit and this is perfectly right. And to make sure this is not repeated on very regular basis but only rare occassion, there is already limitation rule, that on normal occassion works perfectly. Show me a single team you would call a daytrader that ruins the game (as you say) who doesnt play arcade matches. Good luck with searching.
About TPA. As it was mentioned, the nature of market system is about different prices for similar players. Sometimes players go for big bargain, sometimes they go are big robberies. That is perfectly normal. The work for admins is to recognize when there was a cheating involved. And this must always be judged case by case, never automatically.
DayTrader:
the one who, taking advantage of a game imbalance,
buys and sells players in an unrealistic way only to accumulate money in order to then buy superplayers and win by "drugging" the system.
example:
if I'm a wild trader:
I connect 20 times a day, check all the auctions, buy 10-20 players a week and sell as many, with an average stay of a few weeks. I have 40-50-60 players in the squad, many do not use them, do not train them, they are only there to be resold for profit.
So instead of playing sokker I play a finance game, I am a broker of the market.
Trading is an important part of the game, but in this game, today, it allows you to be exploited in an unbalanced way. Nobody wants to eliminate trading, We ask to balance it
the one who, taking advantage of a game imbalance,
buys and sells players in an unrealistic way only to accumulate money in order to then buy superplayers and win by "drugging" the system.
example:
if I'm a wild trader:
I connect 20 times a day, check all the auctions, buy 10-20 players a week and sell as many, with an average stay of a few weeks. I have 40-50-60 players in the squad, many do not use them, do not train them, they are only there to be resold for profit.
So instead of playing sokker I play a finance game, I am a broker of the market.
Trading is an important part of the game, but in this game, today, it allows you to be exploited in an unbalanced way. Nobody wants to eliminate trading, We ask to balance it
I see only effusion, but I want rational discussion
I will repeat my demand. Could you please show me a single team you would call a daytrader that ruins the game (as you say) who doesnt play arcade matches?
Can you prove me wrong that the current system would be balanced if the arcade bug were fixed?
I will repeat my demand. Could you please show me a single team you would call a daytrader that ruins the game (as you say) who doesnt play arcade matches?
Can you prove me wrong that the current system would be balanced if the arcade bug were fixed?
Lets be honest, actually the problem is not specifically WILD TRADERS ! The problems are the tons of millions money sleeping in clubs and less and less valuable players on the market : so If I NEED a (particular) player i prefer to put 1-2 millions over the price to get this player (and im really not sure to win this bid!!) That 's actually the problems with market.
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Most effective way to deal with daytrading is additional taxes.
No, most effective would be to impede selling until half season has passed from buying.
No, most effective would be to impede selling until half season has passed from buying.
I see only effusion, but I want rational discussion
If you don't understand is your problem
Can you prove me wrong that the current system would be balanced if the arcade bug were fixed?
This Is an effusion.. can you prove me the opposite?
Fix arcade bug Is First step, important of course, i think Is not enough
There are a very rational thread called "trading reform" where there are a lot of rational possibile solutions from different managers. We understand you think that fix arcade problem is enough, for other managers not, Devs will decide.
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If you don't understand is your problem
Can you prove me wrong that the current system would be balanced if the arcade bug were fixed?
This Is an effusion.. can you prove me the opposite?
Fix arcade bug Is First step, important of course, i think Is not enough
There are a very rational thread called "trading reform" where there are a lot of rational possibile solutions from different managers. We understand you think that fix arcade problem is enough, for other managers not, Devs will decide.
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@slavista I will give you real example I was building for 17y old def that worth 1-2m euro max and Esti guy was biding all the time I wanted that play because I promised to train him no info of talent etc. The guy send me message I have 15m euro in my account I will make the price as I want at 3m euro he send me message pls bid one more time do not want player ...
Is this fair ?
Is this fair ?
The overbidding can happen by someone who doesn't do overtrading. Watch users who pay ridiculous prices because of nationality! Look for Suomi, Hrvatska young players who probably most of you would ask for TPA.
Also, lots of users have millions in bank but also spent more than 90% of users for their players, me including.
Selling players after 2, 3 jumps in skills IS NOT OVER TRADING!
@sviktorov: the situation mentioned by you is not common and you know that. This should not be an example to force your opinion.
Fix the arcade bug and that will "kill" at least 90% of the over traders.
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Also, lots of users have millions in bank but also spent more than 90% of users for their players, me including.
Selling players after 2, 3 jumps in skills IS NOT OVER TRADING!
@sviktorov: the situation mentioned by you is not common and you know that. This should not be an example to force your opinion.
Fix the arcade bug and that will "kill" at least 90% of the over traders.
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Can you prove me wrong that the current system would be balanced if the arcade bug were fixed?
This Is an effusion.. can you prove me the opposite?
1, You claim that bad wild traders destroy the game and transfer restrictions must be implemented to destroy them
2, I claim that the bad wild traders exists only because of arcade bug exploitation. I ask you to show me a single user that is not exploiting the bug and who is a wild trader who destroys the game.
3, You ignore my argument and counter-attacking by telling me to show you a proof that such users doesn't exist.
4, How am I supposed to prove something that doesn't exist? How am I supposed to prove that there is not a single user that does not exploit the bug and who is bad wild trader? On the other hand you can prove existence of the only one such user and I will admit you were right and I was wrong and fixing the bug is not enough to solve the problem.
I have no problem to admit that I was wrong if you prove it by a good argument
This Is an effusion.. can you prove me the opposite?
1, You claim that bad wild traders destroy the game and transfer restrictions must be implemented to destroy them
2, I claim that the bad wild traders exists only because of arcade bug exploitation. I ask you to show me a single user that is not exploiting the bug and who is a wild trader who destroys the game.
3, You ignore my argument and counter-attacking by telling me to show you a proof that such users doesn't exist.
4, How am I supposed to prove something that doesn't exist? How am I supposed to prove that there is not a single user that does not exploit the bug and who is bad wild trader? On the other hand you can prove existence of the only one such user and I will admit you were right and I was wrong and fixing the bug is not enough to solve the problem.
I have no problem to admit that I was wrong if you prove it by a good argument
What is that TPA shit? I mean what does it stand for?
I saw it multiple times in different topics here like it is well-known acronym but I have no idea what is it.
I saw it multiple times in different topics here like it is well-known acronym but I have no idea what is it.
OMG
Seriously? Do you understand you ask me something impossibile? Of course now every wild traders use "arcade bug"... It's OBVIOUS.
You think fix this and ok
I think it's not enough. If you can sell After 1 or 2 friendly match, if you can have 50-60 players, if you can buy 100 players per week... Problem Will not solved... IMHO.
Seriously? Do you understand you ask me something impossibile? Of course now every wild traders use "arcade bug"... It's OBVIOUS.
You think fix this and ok
I think it's not enough. If you can sell After 1 or 2 friendly match, if you can have 50-60 players, if you can buy 100 players per week... Problem Will not solved... IMHO.
So 2 friendlies is also too short. Then you cannot say you have something against wild traders, but against more than at least 50-60% of users :))
PS: will not reply again on this topic, as its becoming nonsense :)
PS: will not reply again on this topic, as its becoming nonsense :)
Heureka! Now I see where is the problem of our misunderstanding. You think that the game without arcades works like this.
I think it's not enough. If you can sell After 1 or 2 friendly match, if you can have 50-60 players, if you can buy 100 players per week... Problem Will not solved... IMHO.
But You could not be far away from the truth. You can only play up to 22 players in week and the number of matches player must play rises with the number of sales in last weeks. It is not like could sell them all after playing two games. But I have already stressed this several times. You must have read it. And I feel tired repeating the same again and again
and I agree with fizz_alin that the discussion is pointless when it is based on totally wrong presumptions and inability to change them.
I think it's not enough. If you can sell After 1 or 2 friendly match, if you can have 50-60 players, if you can buy 100 players per week... Problem Will not solved... IMHO.
But You could not be far away from the truth. You can only play up to 22 players in week and the number of matches player must play rises with the number of sales in last weeks. It is not like could sell them all after playing two games. But I have already stressed this several times. You must have read it. And I feel tired repeating the same again and again
and I agree with fizz_alin that the discussion is pointless when it is based on totally wrong presumptions and inability to change them.
the discussion is pointless when it is based on totally wrong presumptions and inability to change them.
like yours, I agree ;)
but I still try to explain for those who know how to listen.
Arcade bug need to be fixed. We are all agree.
After that you can do exactly the same wild trading as now, with the only difference that in turn you will have to play 1 or 2 friendly match to the players "meat for the market"... ok just little bit less "wild training" (maybe slow it down a little) but absolutely not enough to balance the trading system IMHO. to balance the system need some of solutions proposed on "trading reform thread", not only by me (there are at the moment 5 points and i proposed only 2), like tax reselling, like max number of players, like minum period of stay for players, like max number of buy or sell per week etc, etc....
only Devs will be able to decide how to balance and whether to do it.
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like yours, I agree ;)
but I still try to explain for those who know how to listen.
Arcade bug need to be fixed. We are all agree.
After that you can do exactly the same wild trading as now, with the only difference that in turn you will have to play 1 or 2 friendly match to the players "meat for the market"... ok just little bit less "wild training" (maybe slow it down a little) but absolutely not enough to balance the trading system IMHO. to balance the system need some of solutions proposed on "trading reform thread", not only by me (there are at the moment 5 points and i proposed only 2), like tax reselling, like max number of players, like minum period of stay for players, like max number of buy or sell per week etc, etc....
only Devs will be able to decide how to balance and whether to do it.
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