Subject: [GD] Match Engine

Order of play is associated with training and no more than 5 players can be placed with the same order. According to the announced changes in training, this restriction could be eliminated and the tactics would be more dynamic.

An example. Assigning a defender or forward the MID order with low secondary skills is a risk that the coach must take, but perhaps it is what he is looking for in that player. I would like to see tactics like Scolari's famous 3-6-1 in 2002 with Brazil.

Regards

There should be an option to turn off wing mindjacking. If a player gets close to the line (it doesn't have to be too close, it can be far away from the goal), that's it, your player is reduced to pace and tech, and maybe pass. If I am not really trying to play wing, then I don't want my mid to start dribbling from the middle of the pitch.

Saturday became a Screaming-at-the-screen-day. What am I watching...

Also I think I had set up a tactic change, I can't be sure because, for some reason, loading previous setup doesn't load the additional tactic... I always add it manually, maybe I forgot this time.
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The training of a skill should never be dependent on the order.
So I mean... playmaking and passing shouldn't train less fast for defs and strikers and scoring shouldn't train slower for mids and defs. But a maximum of 5 def orders, 5 mid orders and 3 att orders is a good thing...BUT ONLY FOR TRAINING!!!
So it means, in the new system, loss of training because you played with to many or too few def, mid or att orders should be cancelled. It's not logical that a player plays a whole match and after he ''forget'' the training...
But setting a maximum of 5 mids, 5 defs and 3 strikers on a training spot is a must!

@james: The ME is something that needs callibration. There are issues which are irrational and utterly stupid on this kind of football level! I think the implementation of football intelligence is a must!
And I think that needs to go up like the Tactical discipline skill, so it should be dependent on various skills and experience, depending on the position the player plays. So it should go up different for defs than it does for mids, aswell as for strikers...

A defender needs defensive intelligence the most, and strikers offensive intelligence.
mids need a mix of both, but normally not as much as a defender in defensive mind and strikers in offensive mind.

Defenders intelligence should go up with 1) defender skill, 2) matches played with def order, 3) overall experience and 4) playmaking skill

So f.e. you have a defender who has magical defender skill, played 47 matches with defender order, has formidable experience and very good playmaking skill

Number 1 should multiply by 5, number 2 by 4, number 3 by 3 and number 4 by 2

This means...

1) magical defender [15] x 5 = 75
2) 47 matches x 4 = 188
3) Formidable experience [11] x 3 = 33
4) very good playmaker [9] x 2 = 18

Total = 314 defender intelligence

Say you have a midfielder with divine playmaker AND defender but say he played ALL matches with mid-order! and let's give him magical experience...

1) 17 x 5 = 85
2) 0 x 4 = 0 - No matches with def-order!
3) 15 x 3 = 45
4) 17 x 2 = 34

So his total defender intelligence = 164!

It's pretty good, but not nearly as good as the defender!

This skill needs to infuence the choices a player makes when he is in a defensive situation - Even for strikers!!

For strikers, it's the opposite! They should relay on offensive intelligence which should be calculated with the exact same formula BUT the defender skill must be replaced with the striker skill and the def-order match calculator should now calculate the matches with ATT order.

For mid-order players, their choices should be dependent on the total of both defensive and offensive intelligence and added with the amount of matches played with mid-order.
So f.e. a midfielder has played 60 matches with mid-order and has 164 def intelligence and 124 att intelligence it gives 368 football intelligence.

This way a defender should make a better calculation on where he needs to be if the opponent has the ball, in order to not easily got caught with a running player behind him without him noticing the player is there. Also, if a defender runs towards a striker, the other defenders should ''evaluate'' the defensive situation and close the gap if necessary.

For mids, they should not run the ball over the sideline when they are on the wing and they should evaluate the field and the situation more. So if you have the ball, midfielders with a high football intelligence skill will determine to run or pass very quick and if the intelligence skill is high enough, it might trigger the player to make a super pass between the defence and the GK. He would have ''seen'' the gap and play the ball there! off course, in this case, his passing skill will determine if the pass will be accurate enough for the striker to receive the ball.

For strikers, it will determine wether they are in a good scoring/shooting position, wether they should pass the ball.
Also it will trigger them to wait for the run, or start at the right moment, to avoid offside.


Football intelligence will make the ME much more dynamic and unpredictable, but it will counter ''stupid football''!
I think this way, the ME stays a calculation engine, which it should be, but there are much more variables to take into account. And stupid football, as we sometimes see in the current ME, should exist, but only for the ''stupid players''!!

I have a question for the devs: Is it possible that the engine is compensating different random factors with each other? For example, one team is playing much worse than usual, and in turn the other one is missing its chances. This seems to happen a lot, for example in my game yesterday. Often one team also plays badly in the first half and the other in the second. That makes it very hard to understand what's going on, or see the effects of skills and tactics.

I have no problem with chance conversion being random, or with injuries and red cards. That happens in real football too, and it would be boring if results were totally predictable. But in this engine it's pretty much random whether the team is playing well or badly, and that's very frustrating. Please, please make it a priority to improve the engine.

Sometimes it seems like there is a random before the start of a half-time, and then there is active random during the play. Very often players have drastically different performance in the 2nd half. But the game is so random that is it impossible to know.

Sadly, ME doesn't have any priority, it is ignored. And I would understand that if they just came here to replace flash, fix some bugs, and just kept the game alive, but they have so many plans that it's a huge mistake to ignore the central part of the game.

+1

So it means, in the new system, loss of training because you played with to many or too few def, mid or att orders should be cancelled. It's not logical that a player plays a whole match and after he ''forget'' the training...
But setting a maximum of 5 mids, 5 defs and 3 strikers on a training spot is a must!

Interesting conversation, I agree 50% XD

For a defender it will be a priority to clear the ball, for a midfielder to think and look for a good pass, for a striker to dribble and reach the area.

then the intelligence of the player in a certain way is married to the order of play. For example, a forward with the MID order will pass more frequently, that is, he can pivot, but that same forward on a clear goal chance will try to pass. This is what I mean by the good and bad points.

The point is that the player has the freedom to decide this.

For the future training you will train 10 players, regardless of the position they play, they can be 10 midfielders, 9 midfielders and 1 forward, etc.

Regards

for a striker to dribble and reach the area.

Eh...it should be a possibility, but not his priority. The priority of the striker is to make sure the ball hits the net [or at least as an attempt] one way or the other, meaning shooting himself or passing the ball to another player.

then the intelligence of the player in a certain way is married to the order of play.

Now it is, but I feel the order should have only a small influence on the way the player plays. His skills should have the most influence. As for mids...not shooting in front of an empty goal is just plain stupid! Not 1 mid will refuse to shoot if he has a clear chance! Certainly if your tactic brings that player in front of the goal...

For the future training you will train 10 players, regardless of the position they play, they can be 10 midfielders, 9 midfielders and 1 forward, etc.


True... but I mean on the pitch... So maximum 5 training spots for mids/game, so I mean... it should not be possible if you train mids f.e., that you set 8 players with mid order in 1 game if all 8 have a mid training spot...

So, you can use 8 mid order spots on the pitch, but no more then 5 might be trainees.
If you train 5 defs and 5 mids you can use all 10 in 1 game... that's what I mean...
(edited)

I think that the big change that could be made to the engine is to be able to modify the tactic according to whether the team has possession of the ball or not.
The ME already distinguishes which team has possession, so the change would not be as big as it seems. The difficulty is that we would no longer have only 35 squares, but 70. For new users it would be terrifying.
But the solution to that was already invented 25 years ago: PC Fútbol 7.

In this image we see that it was only necessary to locate the players on the field according to whether the team had possession or not, and the squares into which the field was divided were automatically accommodated.




Of course, if we wanted to make any modification, for a more advanced user, for example, we could do it.



We could also choose to see only the attack positions or only the defense positions.




I think this system would make a revolution in Sokker and it would be much easier for new players and much more attractive for more tactical players.

I understand all the problems that this would bring (resistance to change, bugs, etc.) but there is nothing but management that is not done.
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Yes. I think sk should have something like basic tactic editor which could be the actual one. And change to advance and apply what u say, more options and maybe higher definition (more than 7x5)

Should be easy for new users but will make a big change to dedicate users
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Nice idea.
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+12

I agree with Bolainas
=)

XD XD XD XD

+1 for offensive + defense position in each squares. Also corner and touchline positions

+1 for offensive + defense position in each squares. Also corner and touchline positions

Yeees!